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Henry ("Fred or Bill") BAILEY

Henry ("Fred or Bill") BAILEY

Male 1899 - 1984  (85 years)    Has 185 ancestors and 5 descendants in this family tree.


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  • Name Henry ("Fred or Bill") BAILEY 
    Nickname Fred or Bill 
    Relationshipwith Teresa Ann GOATHAM
    Born 22 Jun 1899  11, Stainton Street, Westoe, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    • GRO ref: Bailey, Henry q3 1899 S Shields RD 10a 809; GRO online index shows mother's maiden name as Robinson
    Birth certificate for Henry Bailey (b 1899)
    Birth certificate for Henry Bailey (b 1899)
    Baptised 2 Aug 1899  St. Michael’s Church, South Westoe, South Shields, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Gender Male 
    Education From 1904 to 1913 
    • Approximate dates, at school at time of 1911 census; unable to take up scholarship to grammar school as the family needed him to go out to work
    Occupation Coal miner (job unknown) 
    From 1913 to 1915  Seaham Area, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    • I think Granddad was a miner for about a year - this would tie in with the system of people having contracts for a year. Granddad talked about his boyhood but about things he enjoyed and I never heard him say much about his time in the mines, I understand he hated it.
    Military Service Royal Navy including WW1 and WW2 
    From 24 Feb 1915 to 18 Jun 1946  Various places - at sea, Dartmouth, London, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    • I will add a page with information about Granddad's time in the RN when I have time.

      Granddad hated working in the mines and ran away to see. I understand he falsified his age to join up, his father refusing to go along with this but his mother signed. (I'm not sure the papers I have for Granddad agree with this - tbc).
      He not only spent time on board various ships but also was on the staff at Britannia Royal Naval College, Dartmouth for a while where he got to know Admiral Sir Martin Dunbar-Nasmith who choose him to be his coxswain. This I believe meant he acted as his chaffeur when he was not at sea, he certainly drove when in the navy, though he never took a driving test or had a driving licence.
      Working for the Admiral meant an interesting variety of work. Granddad took part in the Fastnet Race in 1928 on "Amaryllis" and in the first round the Isle of Wight yacht race in 1931, on "Pansy". On one occasion he was tasked with looking after Princess Alexandra when she was on the "Amaryllis".

      Granddad spent time at Trincomalee and I see that the Admiral was Commander-in-Chief of the East Indies Station there from 1932 - 1935; Granddad must have been there for some or all of this time.
      He put off his retirement a little for the Admiral to finish his time in a particular post, looking at the Admiral's positions I think this must have been as Commander-in-Chief, Plymouth, then was about to retire when the Second World War started - and so of course he remained in the Navy for the course of the war. The Admiral didn't need him for all of the war so he was back at sea for some of it. He had a few narrow escapes. He was recalled by the Admiral at one point from a ship which was sunk soon after with the loss of the vast majority on board.

      Starting as a boy at the bottom, Granddad became a Chief Petty Officer by the time he left. I gather he could have been promoted to be an Officer in WW2 had he been willing to work on submarines, but he didn't want this.

      Album of pictures I've scanned so far relating to Granddad's time in the Royal Navy.

      I understand when he first joined up Granddad sent some of his earnings home to his mother for her to save for him. However, he found she had spent his "savings". Understandable - I gather the reason he hadn't been allowed to go to grammar school was not only the cost (e.g. for uniform) but because with a number of younger siblings he was needed out at work. Being in the Navy might have meant that for most of the time there was not the cost of feeding and clothing him, but did not remove the need for him to contribute to the family income.

      Time in navy included being on HMS Royal Soverign in 1936 (as shown by inscription in book he gave to my mother, 12th Oct 1936)

      Of course being in the navy meant Granddad missed much of my mother's growing up - it seems a great shame as he was so good with my brother and I when we were children, and someone to whom we both felt very close.

      Items I have connected with Granddad's time in the Navy (details tbc) include:
      his service book
      a diary he kept duing WW1 (sadly factual and impersonal - even an entry recording that mail arrived gives no indication of whether he received any, let alone his feelings)
      a provisions book for the yacht "Pansy"
      a photo of Granddad on board the yacht "Amaryllis" with Princess Alexandra
    Occupation Worked for Distillers ("Black and White Whisky") 
    From 1946 to 1964  London, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    • The Admiral offered Granddad work when he left the Navy but this offer was conditional on my Grandmother working as well and they didn't want that.
      Probable dates, based on my assumption that he joined Distillers when he left the navy and retiring at the age of 65 (or did he retire at 60?)
    Residence In retirement 
    From 1958 to 1984  17, Central Avenue, Polegate, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    • I'm not sure exactly when my grandparents moved to Polegate, should be able to work it out.
    Died 16 Oct 1984  Princess Alice Hospital, Eastbourne, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Death certificate for Henry Bailey (b 1899)
    Death certificate for Henry Bailey (b 1899)
    Cremation 22 Oct 1984  Eastbourne Crematorium, Eastbourne, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Pet name “Fred” or “Bill” 
    • "Fred" (to his wife and her family, and joint friends)
      I understand it was common to give a false name on early dates. My grandfather did that when he and my grandmother first went out together, calling himself 'Fred'. When he wanted to show he was serious about the relationship he folded his coat so as to show his true name. My grandmother, however, decided she would go on calling him 'Fred'. Her family and any friends they made together consequently knew him as Fred.  

      "Bill" (in the navy / at work to colleagues and friends)
      Due to the song, 'Won't you go home, Bill Bailey' many Bailey's were referred to as Bill. Granddad was no exception.

      Possibly "Harry" (to his family?) - I saw one reference once, but am not sure if this was an error. Generally nephews, nieces etc. knew him as 'Uncle Henry'.
    Funeral 22 Oct 1984  St. John’s Church, Polegate, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Buried 16 Nov 1984  St. Peter’s Church, Stoke Fleming, Devon, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    • (ashes interred)
    Notes 
    • Stories Granddad told about his boyhood

      ... of catching crabs to eat and cooking them on a fire on the beach
      ... of a treat being the one in the family to have the scrapings from the frying pan
      ... a dare-devil activity of walking across a narrow (edge of a bridge?) - a book about Seaham describes what I think Granddad must have spoken of, I will check / add details.
      ... sang in a church choir (not sure if this was in Marsden / Whitburn or Seaham - or both)

      The Gardener
      Possibly when living in London, certainly after moving to Polegate, Granddad was a vegetable gardener for a few years, but I can only remember his garden being largely grass, with the growing of food confined to a line of pears (separating a small ornamental garden from the lawn), a greenhouse with tomatoes (but most of my memories are of just the base of the greenhouse remaining) and rhubarb. One day Granddad told me he couldn't remember where his rhubarb was and could I help him find it. I willingly helped him look. Eventually I asked what was under a bucket and there it was. I was so proud of having helped him; it was many years before I learnt of forcing rhubarb and realised Granddad hadn't been serious!

      Other
      Granddad loved reading, and before he met my grandmother I gather he had wanted to become a lighthouse keeper - a solitary life with plenty of time to read.
      I may have the wrong impression of what he envisaged, though. My stereo-type lighthouse is miles from anywhere, but recently I have realised that granddad spent a number of years as a boy in Marsden where the Souter Lighthouse was I think encompassed by the village (now demolisehd). Granddad may not have fancied such a solitarly life as I imagined.

      Granddad's desire for an education meant he always took an interest in mine, and was an encouragement to me. And I was conscious of how lucky I was, and that I should make the most of my opportunities. I was impressed that he never seemed the least bit jealous, perhaps because although deprived of the education he would have loved he had had a happy life.

      Help / hindrance with this family history
      Help:  Granddad was my one remaining grandparent alive when I first took an interest in my family tree (when I was about 13). He told me as much as he knew about his brothers and sisters and their families. I regret that at the time all I seem to have been interested in recording was names and dates. I am surprised I recorded nothing about his grandparents, uncles or aunts, but this may be because he didn't know the facts I was then looking for. I do know he knew ancestors had come from Devon, he had an address of a relation in Devon (I think the Dawlish area), that he had been given when in Devon in the Navy (this ties in with what I now know). Unfortunately due to the way mining families moved around I did not manage to progress with Granddad's side of the tree during his life time.
      Hindrance:  After my Grandmother died I remember my mother being upset that he was throwing out things she (and now I) would have valued e.g. family BMD certificates, newspaper cuttings and the like. I don't know the reason - because they were things that only held memories for my grandmother and wanted to be tidy or because in his grief he couldn't bear to have them? I'm not even sure how right my Mum was, the stamps which led her to think this could have been off mundane correspondence. I would not expected either Granddad or Nanny to have ended up with much in the way of family BMD certs. 
    Person ID I3  All | Teresa's direct ancestors, England: Kent Group (in Go(a)tham One-Name Study), All in the Goatham / Gotham One-Name Study , The descendants of Charles Court and Frances née Tapner
    Last Modified 3 Aug 2019 

    Father Henry BAILEY,   b. 16 Apr 1866, Zoar, St. Budeaux, Devon, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location,   d. 3 Sep 1946, The Royal Infirmary, Sunderland, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location  (Age 80 years) 
    Mother Dorothy ROBINSON,   b. 14 Mar 1870, 68, Washington New Row, Usworth, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location,   d. 23 Jan 1963, Whitburn, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location  (Age 92 years) 
    Married 5 May 1888  Whitburn Parish Church, Whitburn, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Certificate for the marriage of Henry Bailey to Dorothy Robinson
    Certificate for the marriage of Henry Bailey to Dorothy Robinson
    Children How many did Henry and Dorothy have? 
    • According to a newspaper cutting for Henry and Dorothy's Golden Wedding, they had had 7 sons and 6 daughters (4 and 3 then living) - the figures for those still living is right, but I only know of 6 sons.
      Another newspaper cutting says they had 14 children, another only 12!
      By the time of the 1911 census they had had 12 children born alive, of whom 3 had died. Edith was still living then, who would subsequently die in infancy, and William had not been born. I think this is more likely to be accurate than the much later newspaper reports, which would suggest they did have at least 13 children, and if there was a 14th he or she was born after 1911.

      So who was the 13th? Granddad thought that a child named after each of them had died; whilst I can find the earlier Henry I have not found any evidence of a Dorothy. Possibly a child was born before they married and their birth registered as a Robinson. No likely Dorothy found - if there was a daughter Dorothy she would have made the total sons / daughters in the Golden Wedding report the wrong way around - far from impossible, in a local newspaper!

      It seems strange to me that the number of children should be quoted variably. Two possible explanations, apart from errors by newspaper jounalists or typos, could be:
      1. that they had had children still born or had miscarriages  OR
      2. that Dorothy had had one or 2 children before she married Henry. Especially given the good age she lived to, I find it hard to imagine she could have kept this a secret - especially when then counting them at times.

      But a late miscarriage or especially a still-birth I think could quite likely be counted as having a child at times, and yet not at others. (The 1911 census, though, did clearly say they had had 12 children born alive, which suggests I may be missing one who was not a still-birth / late miscarriage).

      With names as common as Bailey and Robinson it is not easy to be certain, without the expense of purchasing a lot of certificates.
    Wedding Anniversary Golden 
    5 May 1938  Garden Street, Houghall, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Henry and Dorothy Bailey Golden Wedding - 1938
    Henry and Dorothy Bailey Golden Wedding - 1938
    Children 12 children 
    Photos
    Bailey brothers and sisters
    Bailey brothers and sisters
    Taken at the wedding of Dorothy Simpson.
    Six of the seven children of Henry Bailey (b 1866) and Dorothy nee Robinson (b 1870) still living in 1966, viz.
    (back row) Will, Henry, John
    (front row) Emily, Doris, Rob
    (Flo is the one still living but not present)
    Documents
    Newspaper notice of the death of Samuel Bailey
    Newspaper notice of the death of Samuel Bailey
    Family ID F98    |  Family Chart

    Family Florence Minnie HAMBLING,   b. 2 Jul 1900, 62, Carlyle Road, Ealing, Middlesex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location,   d. 24 Jan 1974, St. Mary’s Hospital, Eastbourne, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location  (Age 73 years) 
    Courtship From 1926 to 1929 
    • One Remembrance Sunday, I guess in about 1926, when Granddad was on the staff of Dartmouth Royal Naval College, he went with a colleague who was to play Reveille before the 2 minutes silence in Stoke Fleming (about 2 miles from Dartmouth).
      There in the churchyard they met a civilian member of the staff at the college, Syd Huddy, who lived in Stoke Fleming. He introduced them to 2 local girls - my grandmother and a friend. They arranged a date for the 4 of them, my grandmother at first partnering the bugle player. It didn't take long for them to switch partners - and the rest is history.

      My grandfather at first gave his name as "Fred". I believe making up a name was common practice. Then when he got seriously interested in my grandmother he folded his coat for her to see his true name. However, being used to calling him Fred she stuck with it, and he remained Fred - not just to her, but to most people outside of his own family (where he remained Henry) and work colleagues (where he was Bill - due to the old song and his surname).
    Banns of marriage To reflect Granddad's residence at Britannia Royal Naval College 
    Abt Mar 1929  St. Saviour’s Church, Dartmouth, Devon, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Married 1 Apr 1929  St. Botolph’s Church (“The Stump”), Boston, Lincolnshire, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location 
    Children
    +1. Brenda Evelyn BAILEY,   b. 1 Jan 1930, “Electra”, 84, Main Ridge, Boston, Lincolnshire, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location,   d. 21 Jun 2003, Torbay Hospital, Torquay, Devon, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location  (Age 73 years)
     
    Photos
    Last Modified 20 Feb 2016 
    Family ID F3    |  Family Chart

  • Event Map Click to hide
    Link to Google MapsBaptised - 2 Aug 1899 - St. Michael’s Church, South Westoe, South Shields, Co. Durham, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsBanns of marriage - To reflect Granddad's residence at Britannia Royal Naval College - Abt Mar 1929 - St. Saviour’s Church, Dartmouth, Devon, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsMarried - 1 Apr 1929 - St. Botolph’s Church (“The Stump”), Boston, Lincolnshire, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsChild born - Brenda Evelyn BAILEY - 1 Jan 1930 - “Electra”, 84, Main Ridge, Boston, Lincolnshire, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsOccupation - Worked for Distillers ("Black and White Whisky") - From 1946 to 1964 - London, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsResidence - In retirement - From 1958 to 1984 - 17, Central Avenue, Polegate, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsDied - 16 Oct 1984 - Princess Alice Hospital, Eastbourne, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsCremation - 22 Oct 1984 - Eastbourne Crematorium, Eastbourne, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsFuneral - 22 Oct 1984 - St. John’s Church, Polegate, Sussex, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
    Link to Google MapsBuried - 16 Nov 1984 - St. Peter’s Church, Stoke Fleming, Devon, England See the place on a map and other information about it - if available (many more will be in time); also all individuals with events at this location Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install)
     = Link to Google Earth (if installed; see link below to install) 
    Pin Legend Address Church or Cemetery Military service or death Hospital Small location Town / City County, state or province Country Registration District Place of education Court Property Not Set

  • Photos

    Documents
    A present to granddad from his brother John
    A present to granddad from his brother John
    Uncle John gave granddad a Bible - presumably to take to sea with him.

    Histories
    Journey to the pits
    Journey to the pits
    Ancestors travelled from Norfolk and even further from Devon to become coal miners in Co. Durham - but my grandfather reversed his grandfather's actions by running away from mining to go to sea.

    Albums
    Navy Days - of my grandfather, Henry Bailey
    Navy Days - of my grandfather, Henry Bailey (15)
    A few photos that belonged to my grandfather relating to his time in the navy. (Lots more to add - photos and other material)